Video:
Rove sources confirm Novak conversation; Cheney
role in CIA leak questioned
RAW STORY and BRADBLOG.com Published:
May 25, 2006
In Hardball's daily dish on the CIA leak trial Thursday,
MSNBC's David Shuster said the latest filings raise
new questions about Vice President Cheney's potential
role in the outing of a CIA agent, and that sources
close to Karl Rove confirm that Rove did have a
followup conversation about his calling conservative
columnist Robert Novak. A report in the <i>National
Journal</i> today suggests Novak considered
'covering' for Rove in the case.
Transcript follows.
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CHRIS MATTHEWS, MSNBC ANCHOR: On Monday, Hardball
correspondent David Shuster first reported the
likelihood Vice President Cheney himself would
be called as a witness stand by prosecutors in
the CIA leak case against Scooter Libby. Last
night, prosecutors filed a motion formally notifying
Libby and the Court that Cheney may, in fact,
be a prosecution witness. The new pre-trial documents
underscore the central role of Vice President
Cheney in his office's focus on an administration
critic whose wife worked at the CIA and saw her
cover status compromised. Here now is David Shuster.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DAVID SHUSTER, MSNBC CORRESPONDENT (voice over):
The latest prosecution filings reveal Vice President
Cheney had a greater role than previously known
in the actions that led to the outing of CIA operative
Valerie Wilson.
It was Wilson's husband, ambassador Joe Wilson,
who wrote this op-ed criticizing the Bush administration's
case for war with Iraq. Prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald
states, as the defendant Scooter Libby admitted
in his grand jury testimony, he communicated extensively
with the Vice President regarding the Wilson op-ed
during the relevant time period and received direction
from the Vice President regarding his response.
Fitzgerald also said this. The state of mind
of the Vice President as communicated to defendant
is directly relevant to the issue of whether the
defendant knowing made false statements to federal
agents and the grand jury."
JONATHAN TURLEY, GW law center: "Everything
ends up at Dick Cheney's desk. His right hand
man is indicted, he's intimately involved in the
Niger allegation with the weapons of mass destruction.
He's the one who seems to have instructed Libby.
The biggest question is not whether he will be
called as a witness, but why he wasn't a co-conspirator."
SHUSTER: According to Libby's grand jury testimony
about Cheney, the Vice President saw Joe Wilson's
op-ed as an attack on his credibility. Prosecutor
question to Libby: Was it a topic that was discussed
on a daily basis? Libby: Yes sir. Question: And
it was discussed on multiple occasions each day,
in fact? Libby: Yes sir. Question: And during
that time did the Vice President indicate he was
upset that this article was out there which falsely
in his view attacked his own credibility? Libby:
Yes sir. Question: And do you recall what it is
that the Vice President said? Libby: I recall
that he was very keen to get the truth out. He
wanted to get all the facts out about what he
had or hadn't done, what the facts were or were
not. He was very keen about that and said it repeatedly.
One alleged fact the Vice President seemed to
zero in on was the idea that nepotism contributed
to Joe Wilson's findings. On a copy of the Wilson
op-ed, Cheney wrote, quote, did his wife send
him on a junket? Prosecutors are not asserting
that Cheney instructed Libby to leak to reporters
and then lie about it to the grand jury.
But Patrick Fitzgerald argues that Cheney's interactions
with Libby were a key part of what motivated Libby
to obstruct the investigation.
Fitzgerald indicated that he may call Cheney
as a prosecution witness. Cheney's testimony would
be used to prove that Libby learned Valerie Wilson's
identity from the Vice President and other government
officials, not from reporters.
SOL WISENBERG, former deputy independent counsel:
"If you are the prosecutor, you want to be
looking at everything, every little thing that
could get you to convince a jury, this is not
the kind of thing that a person would forget."
SHUSTER: Last week, Scooter Libby's defense team
downplayed the significance of Vice President
Cheney's notes on the Wilson column by declaring
Libby never saw the notes until the FBI showed
him a copy.
But in the actual grand jury testimony, released
by Fitzgerald, Libby said of the column, quote,
"it's possible if it was sitting on his desk
that, you know, my eye went across it."
Documents released earlier in the case indicate
Vice President Cheney and Libby talked about the
Wilsons on the very day Libby allegedly leaked
her identity to two reporters. Is Patrick Fitzgerald
trying to build a case against Vice President
Cheney?
JONATHAN TURLEY, GW law center: "Sometimes,
prosecutors will not indict someone in the hopes
that a former colleague will flip, like Scooter.
But I gotta tell you, they can't wait until the
cows come home, Scooter Libby is not going to
flip on Dick Cheney."
SHUSTER: Meanwhile, in the investigation of Karl
Rove, sources close to the presidential advisor
are now confirming a story first reported in the
national journal that Rove, who was a source for
columnist Bob Novak, later had a separate conversation
with Novak after the investigation began.
Former federal prosecutors are convinced Fitzgerald
has explored whether Rove and Novak coordinated
their testimony.
But today, a spokesman for Karl Rove said quote,
"Karl Rove has never urged anyone, directly
or indirectly, to withhold information from the
special Counsel or to testify falsely. Circulating
such speculation now is nothing short of irresponsible."
SHUSTER: (on-camera) But the contention is not
that Karl Rove urged Bob Novak to withhold information,
rather it's that Rove was assured early in the
case that Novak was not going to burn him. Today,
Robert Novak was unavailable for comment. As for
the overall investigation, including the Libby
case, there was also no comment today from the
official who has now become a central figure,
Vice President Cheney.
