Hersh: Obama finally ‘taking control’ on Afghanistan

By David Edwards and Muriel Kane
Thursday, November 12th, 2009 -- 1:29 pm
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obamaarlington Hersh: Obama finally taking control on AfghanistanIn the wake of an AP report on Wednesday that President Barack Obama is not satisfied with any of the options on Afghanistan he has received from his national security team and is demanding revisions, MSNBC's Rachel Maddow turned to veteran investigative journalist Seymour Hersh for insight.

"It could be huge," Hersh told Maddow, "simply that the president's finally saying, 'I'm taking control.'"

"The one thing that mystified a lot of people," Hersh explained, "was the decision to let General McChrystal write a report. There's no general in history that will come back, given that assignment, and say 'We can't win.'"

"This is basically a war, at best, that's going to be a stalemate," continued Hersh. "And so Obama is just putting his foot down, and that's great. ... He's grabbing it and he hasn't been grabbing it until now."

Hersh also commented on a New York Times story which revealed that the US Ambassador to Afghanistan, former Lieutenant General Karl Eikenberry, had cabled Washington last week to express "his reservations about deploying additional troops to the country," thereby putting himself "in stark opposition to the current American and NATO commander in Afghanistan, Gen. Stanley A. McChrystal, who has asked for 40,000 more troops."

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Hersh described Eikenberry's cable as "big news," especially because Eikenberry has been one of a group of generals -- which also includes McChrystal, Petraeus, and Odierno -- who graduated from West Point around 1973-75 and have stuck together over the years as what is seen by other military leaders as a "West Point Mafia."

According to Hersh, this has caused "a lot of trauma within the Army, which is very resentful. ... The top of the Army ... they've been very unhappy with the McChrystal appointment and the way things have been going."

That is why Hersh sees it as significant that Eikenberry is now steering an independent course. "This summer inside the embassy," he told Maddow, "there was a lot of concerns about the stability -- literally the mental stability -- of Karzai. And I think Eikenberry probably knows more than most people."

"Eikenberry is simply, I think, reflecting a huge split," Hersh concluded, "because he's now splitting from the McChrystal counter-insurgency wing that's been dominated by Petraeus."

Hersh called his conclusion about Eikenberry a "heuristic guess," but it is supported by one online analysis which tracks Eikenberry's statements since 2007 and suggests that "General McChrystal is on a special mission based a specific philosophy of warfare and that General Eikenberry is performing his duty according to his current assignment with an ongoing evaluation of the various players and facts at hand."

"General Eikenberry is both a soldier and scholar of history and political science," this analysis concludes. "He knows the history of occupations that fail to deliver for the populace and he's telling us right now that the U.S. can't succeed with more military forces in a nation run by an illegitimate president who has been exposed for election fraud. More troops are not the solution."

This video is from MSNBC's The Rachel Maddow Show, broadcast Nov. 11, 2009.



Download video via RawReplay.com

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Story comments are below...

  • lucky
    ending the occupation IS an alternative:
    http://www.commondreams.org/view/2009/11/11-8

    Fighting small groups of religious extremists will always be a law enforcement concern, not a military one.

    The solution to many political problems in that area is to support democracy and get the CIA the hell out. We started destroying the Afghans when we armed the mujahadeen. We are and have been there for a pipeline and military regional dominance to protect gas/oil, and for no other reason.
  • paulkussmann
    If I were Obama I would ask whether we can we expect the Taliban , if they are empowered in either Afghanistan or Pakistan, which I think will be the likely results of our pulling out, to fight Alquida? After all, alquida has shown itself to be our real enemy, not the Taliban.

    I also think we should pull out...but ending the occupation is not a plan. How will we support Democracy in the absence of our troops? Should that even be our goal?

    The Taliban has shown it's strength before. It is not a small group of religious extremist. It is a political movement based upon Sharia Law. What would be the plan to contain them? Should there be a plan to contain them or just turn our heads while they stone and disfigure recalcitrants?

    Pakistan is the key. India holds the trump card in Kahsmir ( as Israel does in Palestine) ...for the Islamic nations . Should a plan deal with India and Israel...like a United Nations Resolution supported by the Great USA? Should we deal with the cancer and not just lance the pimple?
  • lucky
    I think ending the occupation is a plan. Perhaps we can encourage some settlement of issues in Kashmir, as you mention. Empowering women is the key. I think we will be welcomed to build schools, infrastructure, etc,. but if we bring force, we will be treated as occupiers.
  • Mikethedog
    Seymour Hersh has never been wrong. Even the most bizarre stories turn out to be true... for instance Dick's assassination squad. If Hersh says it it's true, this war could be coming to an end. Let's hope so.
  • lousgirl84
    I meant to say "everything" and not anything. It's wayy to early in the morning. I need to re-read my posts.
  • SouthernYankee
    Mr Hersch is like E.F. Hunting, when he speaks everyone should listen. He has always been a torn in the white house no matter who is the commander-in-chief. To bad we don't have any more Hersch's.
  • Mikethedog
    Google Seymour Hersh... Very impressive, I wouldn't argue with him.
  • SouthernYankee
    Indeed.
  • buckqjohnson
    The Alternative as some have commented on is to declare victory and GET OUT. The Russians where in that place for 17 years and where eventually driven out by the Taliban and soon after the USSR dissentegrated also Alexander couldnt' control it and even the British couldn't control it. This place is one of the places that Empires go to Die, seriously. When an empire gets to big and to powerful and overstretches itself, it stretches into Afghanistan. I think the reason why Obama hasn't made a decision is because he truly believes that this is Vietnam redux, and instead of doubling down and seeing if he can get a victory out of this mess he's thinking that maybe I should just call a conference and pull all soldiers home from Afghanistan. Another reason he won't say that now is that he may be waiting for the voting and signing of the Health Care Reform Bill that was voted in the House and is supposed to be debated in the Senate next week. If he dropped a bombshell of pulling out of that place he may lose the very people that he needs for the vote in the senate.

    Even the soldiers know that Afghanistan is unwinnable, what they are being told to do is to fight and die for the US and the President and political movers and shakers to save face ON A MISTAKE.
  • buck; excellent point i did not think about the health care vote. problem; the rethugs do not want it to go anywhere. Goldman Sachs said the best thing to do about health care is nothing. it is friday wonder how many banks will shut down today? Afghanistan will be talibanized by the taliban. Lets hope the old game show [lets make a deal] will be played, we have to leave as son as possible.
  • Obi-jonKenobi
    I re-watched a bit of Frontline's excellent piece on Afghanistan, "Obama's War", last night.

    McChrystal was interviewed and was frank enough to admit that everytime troops come in to "reclear" an area, it gets harder. The trust level of the locals has gone down because the troops left after the area was "cleared" and they paid the price when the Taliban returned. The troops then return and expect support from the locals who have been abandoned.

    The unit that the cameraman followed in Obama's War were in the process of clearing an area for the THIRD time!! It was truly cringworthy to watch the scene where some 20-some year old sergeant lectures the locals that they aren't "cooperating" because they refuse to return to and use the abandoned market place the Americans say is now safe. The locals have been told by the Taliban not to use the market. And now they politely listen but ignore the sergeant's entreaties. They know better - Americans will be gone at some point, the Taliban won't.

    Sad to watch brave and sincere young men in such a foolish and bungled mess. Talk about "innocents abroad"!! Mark Twain would be laughing if he weren't crying.
  • Over 2000 innocent Afghan civilians have died so far this year. The number keeps escalating. If we escalate they escalate. The Afghan people see us as occupiers, the Taliban sees us as targets.
  • paulkussmann
    To step into President Obama"s shoes, I would ask the following questions? What could possibly be the plan to defend against the Taliban if they take over Afghanistan and Pakistan, as is likely if we pull out? Is "peace" with the Taliban possible? Could we stand idly by while women are stoned for adultery?

    I agree a military victory is not possible and will go on forever with our boys dying needlessly as they did in Vietnamn. If we showed mutilated bodies arriving by the casketload to Dover, we would stop our empire building...there would be rioting in our streets. But what is the alternative?
  • While the Joint Chiefs led by Curtis LeMay were howling for JFK to let them bomb Cuba into rubble, he was secretly talking peace and accommodation with Khrushchev (directly) and Castro (through intermediaries), both of whom were having the same problems with their own bullet-heads (including Che Guevara).

    This is the primary reason why powers at the Pentagon and CIA offed him. Abraham Bolden's testimony confirms that his fellow Secret Service agents also held JFK in contempt, saying during their drunken poker parties they'd "step out of the way" if somebody shot at him.

    The culture of brute force likes killing people and breaking things. They like peace as much as Bush 41 liked broccoli. Put it another way, what happens if you put lettuce in a dog's dish?

    That is the whole story in a nutshell.

    If Obama lives to finish 2 terms, he will be among the greats.
  • lucky
    Interesting, according to this video, the Secret Service did in fact, 'step out of the way' in Kennedy's assassination.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XY02Qkuc_f8
    I recently have been reading some of Kennedy's speeches. It's incredible what a level of education and sophistication he had. It seems as if the ancient Greeks would concur. Compare that of course to Sarah Palin - the natural result of an ill-educated, religiously blinded populace. The US has long had a large percentage of bloodthirsty dominionists at the helm. These are the forces at work in the MIddle East today.

    Imo, as long as we have religion, we will have religious extremists. In the case of the Afghans, only time and benevolent assistance can help them now. We should have though about this before we started arming thugs (as we have done in innumerable other places). They were a peaceful nation at one point before our guns showed up. On the law-enforcement side, once we get the CIA out, we can crack down on their drug exporting outside their borders. This will remove power from taliban and warlords (which are mostly the same, imo)

    As far as Obama goes, so far it's been GWB2. Still hoping...
  • Mikethedog
    You speak as though all variables always lead to the same conclusion and nothing ever changes. There will always be war mungers because psychopaths are born not made. That OLD Cheney society is weakening and as long as people like Sy Hersh continue to expose them and the 24 hour news media continues to report it will become more difficult for the psychopaths to hide. And if you put lettuce in my dogs dish he will lap it up... he's diabetic and loves his veggies (an unexpected variable). You are a pessimit.
  • I think maybe you've got me there. I was a bit over broad in my comment, not including things like Gen. Eikenberry retiring and becoming ambassador to Afghanistan, then suddenly taking the opposite tack exactly like Gen. Maxwell Taylor did in Vietnam. Did you see that fellow Rachel interviewed on this subject? Quite an eerie comparison.

    Gen. Smedley Butler is famous for saying "Like all the members of the military profession, I never had a thought of my own until I left the service."
  • There are only two things we should fight for. One is the defense of our homes and the other is the Bill of Rights.
    Smedley Butler
  • lucky
    Psychopaths are born, not made - really? I believe all children are born innocent. Conversely, I find the previous poster fairly optimistic, ie regarding Obama.
  • Mikethedog
    I find the statment "If Obama lives to finish 2 terms" anything but optimstic. I would say all children are born cute... well most children. Explain why some children at a very young age torture animals for no apparent reason.
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