GOP amendment allows ‘mentally incapacitated’ vets to buy guns

By John Byrne
Monday, November 16th, 2009 -- 9:13 am
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200burr mic GOP amendment allows mentally incapacitated vets to buy gunsA provision in a Senate bill quietly adopted in 2008 yet to reach a vote would allow veterans in the FBI's criminal background system listed as "mentally incapacitated" to purchase firearms.

The provision is coming under fire in the wake of a mass shooting at Ft. Hood Army base earlier this month which killed 13. The new law would allow vets on the FBI list to buy weapons if they haven't been ruled ineligible by a judicial body.

A press release issued by Republican North Carolina Sen. Richard Burr explained his reasoning for the measure in 2008 after it was adopted by the Senate Veterans Affairs Committee. The measure is also supported by a key Democratic senator -- Jim Webb of Virginia.

"Currently, when the Department of Veterans' Affairs (VA) appoints a fiduciary to assist a veteran with managing their financial affairs, VA also deems the veteran mentally incompetent and reports him or her to the FBI's National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS)," Burr's release wrote. "The Veterans Second Amendment Protection Act would require a judicial body to deem a veteran, surviving spouse, or child as a danger to himself or others before being listed in NICS, which would prohibit the veteran from being able to purchase certain firearms. The legislation is supported by the American Legion, Veterans of Foreign Wars, AMVETS, and the Military Order of the Purple Heart.

"I am very pleased the committee endorsed this legislation protecting our veterans' second amendment rights," Burr said in the statement. "My bill would ensure America's brave men and women enjoy the rights they fought so hard to protect. This legislation was included in a larger piece of legislation that will improve the care provided to our veterans. I hope the Senate can quickly consider this bill and I urge my colleagues to support it."

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Mother Jones noted opposition to the provision in a story Monday.

The Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, they noted, believes the proposal is "dangerous" and asserts that it could enable "over 100,000 mentally incapacitated or incompetent persons" to buy firearms who are currently prevented from doing so by the US Veterans' Administration.

Despite the Ft. Hood shootings -- attributed to Army psychiatrist Maj. Nadal Hasan -- Burr defends his proposal. In a recent interview with Fox News, the conservative Carolina senator said the Brady Campaign was using the incident to "exploit the senseless murder of American soldiers in the quest to secure personal triumph."

"Responding to Burr Thursday in an open letter, Helmke wrote, 'it is hardly 'exploitative' to have an honest debate' about the proposal, which would cancel out key provisions of the Gun Control Act of 1968 and override standards used by the VA for nearly four decades," Mother Jones' Corbin Hiar notes.

"Contrary to your reported assertion that our opposition to your bill is a matter of my 'personal agenda,' or to secure some 'personal triumph,' the issue is the safety of our veterans, their families, and the nation they have so valiantly served," Paul Helmke added in the letter to Burr. "In the wake of a mass shooting committed by a serviceman on a heavily-fortified Army base, it is hardly 'exploitive' to have an honest debate about your proposal to allow guns in the hands of thousands of individuals already determined to present sufficient risk that they should be denied firearms."

"Your bill," he continued, "would allow veterans determined to be 'mentally incapacitated, deemed mentally incompetent, or experiencing an extended loss of consciousness' to possess firearms by removing their names from the Brady Law’s National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS)."

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Story comments are below...

  • imwc
    i thought republicans were already allowed to buy guns...?...
  • dennycrane
    But now, they can leave them lying around "loaded" so their media can lay "eggs" in the skulls of the sheeples.
  • The bill actually says: "The mentally incapacitated, also known as "rightwingers", "dittoheads", "teabaggers", or "retards", ....................."

    Maybe they'll all shoot each other...by accident, of course. "Look at this new gun I just purchased...WHOOPS!!!!!!!!!!! It was loaded!!!!!!! I got it at K-Mart."
  • Phil E. Drifter
    This is Republicans causing problems with every bill that enters Congress so that nothing can get accomplished because everyone will be bickering over every bill that comes to the floor.
  • dimensio
    "According to a Republican reading of the Second Amendment, serial killers, psychopaths, crazy people, a guy who wants to kill his bytch 'cause she is cheating on his ass, all have the right to purchase any caliber of weapon they want, stat!"

    I am aware of few, if any, Republican-led advocacy groups who have argued such. In fact, the majority of firearms rights advocates, regardless of political affiliation, do not oppose extant federal prohibitions on firearms possession by felons, individuals who have been adjudicated as mentally defective or individuals who have been convicted of misdemeanor domestic abuse. Additionally, I am unaware of a significant opposition to a repeal of extant federal regulations of rifled firearms chambered in a caliber above .50. Can you please provide a reference in justification of your accusation?
  • dennycrane
    I suppose you have something to say if I want to carry my "trebushay" around with me.
  • dimensio
    I am unable to discern any rational meaning from your statement.
  • ykwrecords
    I believe he was joking, dumbass.
  • JPMP
    And, what, exactly "would require a judicial body to deem a veteran" ... "a danger to himself or others"? A fatal shooting? A MASS fatal shooting?
  • According to a Republican reading of the Second Amendment, serial killers, psychopaths, crazy people, a guy who wants to kill his bytch 'cause she is cheating on his ass, all have the right to purchase any caliber of weapon they want, stat!
  • dimensio
    The reported effect of the amendment is being misrepresented. In fact, the proposed amendment would restore firearms ownership rights to military veterans who had completed a course of treatment and thus were no longer suffering from the mental impairment that had previously restricted their right to firearms ownership. The Brady Campaign opposes this amendment because they continually seek measures to further limit the right to keep and bear arms as a means of furthering their ultimate goal of total civilian disarmament.
  • jimthebeam
    The amendment "would cancel out key provisions of the Gun Control Act of 1968 and override standards used by the VA for nearly four decades,"

    In this case the Brady Campaign is trying to keep in place what has been there since 1968. They are not expanding anything. This limitation was in place before there was a Brady Campaign. This amendment will loosen control of gun ownership rather than tightening it as your spin indicates.
  • dimensio
    I have not suggested that the amendment would "tighten" firearms ownership controls. I have merely accurately noted that the amendment would serve to restore firearms ownership rights to individuals who are no longer deemed mentally impaired and thus for whom there exists no justification for maintained abridgment of firearms ownership rights.
  • quincunx
    Isn't this the same legislation as previously reported by RawStory? The point there was that the ex-psyc major, become PhD, could make the determination sign-sealed-and-delivered without going to court or allowing the 'subject' the right of challenging it in court! As a physicist, I think psyc majors should get the help they need that led them to that major and PhD psycologists should humble themselves and actually help people, because I think Psychology is not on the same level as a real profession that would permit such authoritative, unchallenged acceptance by a court of their opinions.
  • dimensio
    I have conducted some further investigation and I have discovered that Senator Burr's amendment is intended to effectively repeal a ruling made by the administration of former President Bush that allowed for the abridgment of firearms possession rights solely based upon the word of a doctor and with no application of due process. Evidently the Brady Campaign, and opponents of Senator Burr's amendment, are in agreement with Mr. Bush's decision to abridge civil liberties without due process.
  • bkrupps
    Continued stupidity by the small caliber brain people. Any attempt to civilize the country and prevent needless gun deaths is opposed by the lynch mob. "He who lives by the gun......"
  • OldAtlantic
    Illegals should not own guns. The Senate brings more legal immigrants to own guns. They steal welfare and ER already. They gang rape white teens at Richmond High. Stop all immigration including aslyum and family reunification. That will start to bring real safety. Safety from the Senate. The Senate kills with legal immigration. The immigrants are the instrumentality of the Senate's hate. When the gang raped the white teen at Richmond High it was the Senate doing it. They were just using the Latino's as an instrumentality of their hate.
  • dennycrane
    The immigrants have guns to protect themselves from "your" type. Pretty soon, with all the "inter-racial" marriages, you are going to look like a "fleck" of dandruff on a black scarf.
  • Satan
    I'm not worried about it, the biggest bunch of murderers in the U.S. that are allowed to possess weapons are still the losers that serve in the U.S. military. If you want to stop murder, you'd think Raw would be more concerned about the biggest group of murderers instead of these random lone wacko's that make up their bread and butter story wise. Phonies!
  • rickpetes
    I disagree wholeheartedly with you. It's the police that commit the most murders; they just happen to be in positions where it's easy to cover up their malfeasance. We should deny weapon ownership by police officers.
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