Hitchens: Christianity is a fraud if it’s not literally true

By David Edwards and Daniel Tencer
Monday, October 26th, 2009 -- 9:45 am
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christopherhitchens Hitchens: Christianity is a fraud if its not literally trueIf the story of Jesus Christ isn't literally true, then Christianity is a fraud that promotes "a positively wicked doctrine," conservative writer Christopher Hitchens told Fox & Friends Monday morning.

Hitchens, an avowed atheist whose 2007 book God is Not Great attempts to divorce conservatism from religious teachings, discussed the role of religion in American society in the wake of a recent study (PDF) that shows the number of Americans who claim no religious affiliation has roughly doubled in the past two decades, from 8.2 percent in 1990 to 15 percent in 2008.

The study, conducted by Trinity College in Hartford, Connecticut, predicts that a full one-quarter of Americans will have no religious affiliation by 2028. The study notes that the number of non-believers among younger people is considerably higher than among older people, suggesting that the trend of Americans growing less religious will continue in coming years.

Those people who claim no religious affiliation are "not all atheists by any means," Hitchens told host Gretchen Carlson. "They're just people who don't attend a church, don't have a faith. I think it's fair to call them agnostics. The number of people, like myself, who think religion is false, that it's a delusion and that it's bad for you, is still pretty small."

Hitchens said Americans are increasingly turning against organized religion "because they want to push back against theocracy and the parties of God and the awful challenge they pose to us internationally."

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"By the way, your side seems to be winning in public schools, at least across America," Carlson told Hitchens.

Hitchens appeared on Fox with pastor Douglas Wilson, who appeared along with Hitchens in the recent documentary Collision, which explores the battle of ideas between the religious and the non-religious.

The two came to an unexpected agreement on one issue: They both attacked the notion, popular among some secular thinkers, that Christianity is a socially positive thing even if it's not true.

"If Jesus didn't come back from the dead, then Christianity is appalling, it's an appalling fraud and delusion and every unbeliever should attack it," Wilson said. "Christianity is not good for the world because it makes people decent and sober and that sort of thing. At the end of the day, if it's not true, if it's not objectively true, then I don't have any more use for it than Christopher does."

Hitchens echoed that idea, but made it clear he does actually consider Christianity a fraud.

"They say, well the Bible story's not really true, they're morality tales. Don't listen to it, because if it's based on a fraud, if the virgin birth and the resurrection and the miracles did not occur, which they did not, then those teachings are immoral, they teach that sins can be forgiven by throwing them on to a scapegoat -- a positively wicked doctrine."

This video is from Fox News' Fox & Friends, broadcast Oct. 26, 2009.



Download video via RawReplay.com

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Story comments are below...
  • jacbi
    Agreed, Carlson is clueless. She was hoping for a big confrontation. Not saying where I stand here, but I am continously amazed at the number of people who profess to believe that by just saying the magic words "I take Jesus as my personal lord and savior" they have a "Get Out Of Hell Free" card. These very same people may have no real life application of the message that Jesus brought. My brother's keeper and caring for the least of these, is as foriegn to them as if it were to be beamed down by klingons.
    I read Hitchen's as someone who has a big issue with organized Chrisianity today and thru the last 2000 years. He sees Christians as little children enthralled with the bling of the church. He sees us as toddlers who love the fairy tale and are too small minded to see that there is a moral message not some Annie Oakley pass to have a reserved seat in the angelic choir.
    Wilson is wrong. Even without the "magic" show, the message is still there, waiting for us to hear it.
  • damixaustex
    "These very same people may have no real life application of the message that Jesus brought"
    Amen, brother.
    If Christians followed Christ's message, the world would be a better place. Sadly, so many don't.
    The Bible is long overdue for a serious paring down and updating.
  • Adam503
    Uhhh... NO, you don't.

    Either the scripture is holy as it is, warts and all, untouched by human hands

    Or it's not "holy" scripture.

    Either stand behind the whole "Holy Bible" including Jonah riding around in the stomach of a whale, and Jesus being just fine with slavery as an institution...

    ...or admit The Holy Bible is no more holy than The Illiad and The Oddesey.
  • damixaustex
    I was thinking something simpler, like Watership Down with a forward by Thich Nhat Hanh.
    The movies could all be in 30 seconds or less.
  • philedrifter
    Yeah, great. Define "holy:"

    adj ho ly- decided by a small group of people that something is somehow important, basing their opinion on their desire to control unthinking people.
  • urizen9
    holy is an invented nonsense word meaning bullshit in reality.
    saint is similar. there is a whole slew of these.
    socialist is another. The rest you can guess
  • jacbi
    thank you
  • kiboshki
    ' ' ...people who profess to believe that by just saying the magic words "I take Jesus as my personal lord and savior" they have a "Get Out Of Hell Free" card.' '

    Indeed. The worst thing that happened to Christianity was the whole "Salvation by Faith" vs "Salvation by Deeds" debate. It troubles me that so many follow the path of mere belief that leads to intellectual laziness, rather than the path of action to improve the lot of mankind - which I think (or I hope) was the intended message of early Christianity.
  • philedrifter
    mere belief that leads to intellectual laziness

    EXACTLY. I said this, in almost exactly the same way, just the other day:
    'Religion stifles intellectual progress, it is a cancer of the planet.'

    People need to accept the fact that they are finite beings.
  • mannymanny
    actually both christ and paul promote good works, or are you unfamiliar with the gospels? the salvation by faith is a doctrine which promises all humans forgiveness despite their failed humanity.

    it'd be nice if people who try to debate xtianity and its tenets knew a tiny bit about what the hell they are talking about. i find it funny that so many think that simply by saying "there is no god" that they somehow are intellectually superior.
  • kiboshki
    And by the way, I *am* an athiest, born of a very Republican, very FOX News, family of very conservative Christian values.

    I also try to do many good deeds, donate to charities when I can, frequently volunteer my time to literacy concerns, and just try to be a moral, upstanding, nice guy. "Do unto others" and all that. Not because I have a relationship with Christ, or because I fear hell. I do it just because it's common sense, and makes the world a better place.

    But since I lack faith, I suppose I'll burn for those deeds.
  • Independentgal
    Bravo! Great post! I'm someone who believes in God but does NOT believe in religion. I keep my faith to myself and would never dream of pushing it on to another person.

    The minority (thank God!) in this country has become a nation of "Bible thumpers" who are only happy if they can force their beliefs on someone else. Sounds like a control issue to me.

    From what you reveal of yourself in your post, you sound 100% more "Christian" than those who wear their deal-making (with God) on their sleeves and let it become their identity. I'd much rather have a friend like you than one who makes deals for a "get out of Hell free card" (as mentioned by another poster on this board) because I would probably feel an inherent sense of trust. That's NOT something I can say about most Christians who tell ME that I'M going to hell if I don't join lockstep in their beliefs.
  • kiboshki
    I didn't say there is no god. Nor did I even imply that Paul never upheld the value of deeds in a Christian's relationship with God.

    No, I'm not a theologian. But my point is that too many so-called Christians forget James 2:14–26 - the one that calls out the value of both faith *and* deeds - as well as all the scripture that discusses deeds as a good path, as something inherently good in and of itself, even beyond the context of faith.

    Pure faith - without thought, without question - is intellectual laziness. By going down that road in that way, the so-called Christian fails to use his God-given powers of rational thought to actually make a meaningful decision about his relationship with Christ.

    Deeds purely for the benefit of mankind is good, regardless of one's relationship with or belief in God. People of any faith (or lack thereof) can do this part, and many do.

    But an appalling number of so-called Christians do not follow the words of James and DO good. Instead, they sit in their laz-e-boys and call for war, civil injustice, execution, environmental destruction, wealth inequality, educational degradation, and so on, all the while believing they are going to be Saved, while Muslims, Jews, pagans, athiests and liberal Christians shall be cast into the fiery Pit.

    It is *this* attitude of falsely pious pseudo-Christians that disgusts me. Almost as much as your assumptions about me disgust me.
  • urizen9
    Do decently to you and others and forget all that other bullshit.
    It can be done, you know?
  • urizen9
    early xtianity can best be understood as a movie made for the slaves so they can explain their condition and somehow accept it.
    It was a popular success too like Jaws and Psycho. Interestingly they left a lot of sex out of it.
    Maybe you can't mix porn with horror?
  • Independentgal
    Great post!! I especially agree with the "Get Out of Hell Free card" part of your post. Sin all you want during the week, and as long as you "make a deal" with God, you can continue to sin indefinitely. I think most of us are born with an inherent sense of right and wrong. If one has to make deals with God, that's just WRONG!
  • Michael
    Hitchens is a fraud if he's not absolutely right.
  • philedrifter
    No. Your religion is a fraud. Period. I don't care what religion it is, they're all frauds. They promise you everlasting life after you die in this one... in exchange for your money in this one.
  • mannymanny
    thanks for your all-knowing wisdom. although, just for arguments sake, most wise one, there are plenty of xtians and other religious folk who have dedicated their lives to promoting and helping the poor and the sick, etc. no one promised them money. it's people like you, and hitchens, with your arrogance that really pisses off so many others. you won't win debates that way. you just make yourself look as cretinous as the frothing at the mouth fundies.
  • urizen9
    don't give me the crap about morals and doing good. It has nothing to do with superstitions.
    They always bring this crap up.
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